Guild icon
The American Iron Front Collaboration Discord
Other / zine
Avatar
@Steve Mike Here you go.
Avatar
Wonderful
11:08 PM
Gratzi
Avatar
@Envy I should @ you too
Avatar
@Envy can you access this channel?
11:09 PM
Haha yep
Avatar
I can yes
Avatar
There's no role, so they should be able to
11:10 PM
kk
11:10 PM
@Steve Mike I was messaging Sinned before, who does zines, but I haven't gotten a response.
Avatar
I messaged a few members who mentioned writing skills but yes am still waiting for response
šŸ”„ 2
Avatar
And if you want to pull people to help you with anything, you have that list of driven people.
Avatar
@Steve Mike Give people a little time. I know many, like myself, sign in every few days or so, and might not get the message right away.
Avatar
Name ideas for the zine, more are welcome but here are mine -Hail, Columbia! -Stars & Stripes -Spirit of Liberty
Avatar
Avatar
Envy
Name ideas for the zine, more are welcome but here are mine -Hail, Columbia! -Stars & Stripes -Spirit of Liberty
joe hill’s revenge 11/24/2022 6:39 PM
I like spirit of liberty
Avatar
Avatar
Eightman
@Steve Mike Give people a little time. I know many, like myself, sign in every few days or so, and might not get the message right away.
I’m one of those people and this sounds great! I’m a writer as well, we’ll versed at research based writing and regular journalism.
šŸ‘‹ 1
10:40 PM
On the name- I feel like we’re not quite there yet as far as ā€œreclaimingā€ traditional patriotic rhetoric and I’d worry that at this stage it would cause more would-be allies to ignore it than to read it.
Avatar
Names are open for consideration still. Project is still in the very early stages
10:43 PM
As for your writing experience, great! I'd like to get a team of 2 or 3 to start before we accept any ideas to write about
Avatar
I’d lean more toward titles that lean in to egalitarian or antifascist values or even super basic like iron front imagery. Could be something like ā€œ3 Points Pressā€, ā€œIron Pressā€, or ā€œThe Ferrous Flyerā€ šŸ™ƒ
10:47 PM
but yeah! just let me know what you need! I’m in my slow season rn
Avatar
3 Points Press is actually pretty cool, I'll write that one down
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 11/25/2022 11:02 PM
Can I start writing articles tonigjt lol?
šŸ”„ 2
Avatar
If you want, sure. There's no official plans for the zine yet so it might not get printed for awhile though lol
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 11/25/2022 11:25 PM
I could share it with u
11:25 PM
And get constructive criticism
Avatar
If you want! I plan to function more as an editor rather than a journalist so it would be good practice
Avatar
I have some articles I wrote for a lefty online rag I could donate... it's on building non-profit replacements for basic needs.
11:59 PM
You are also welcome to use my consensus structure I posted elsewhere on here as a guide to non-hierarchical decision-making. Either for publication or how to run the zine.
Avatar
I planned on using a small newsroom hierarchy structure, but I wouldn't mind trying something different! Any idea where you posted it?
Avatar
Avatar
Envy
I planned on using a small newsroom hierarchy structure, but I wouldn't mind trying something different! Any idea where you posted it?
joe hill’s revenge 11/26/2022 12:35 AM
If your the editor in chief can I run some article ideas by you in DMs?
12:36 AM
I'm down to be a contract writer at first
12:36 AM
and later take assignments I guess, I think a small newsroom works well
Avatar
Sure! The sooner the zine can start production the better imo
Avatar
Avatar
Envy
I planned on using a small newsroom hierarchy structure, but I wouldn't mind trying something different! Any idea where you posted it?
Avatar
Those who are interested in helping with the zine, I'm planning a meeting to discuss finally getting underway with the project for Saturday, what times would be best for everyone?
Avatar
Avatar
Envy
Those who are interested in helping with the zine, I'm planning a meeting to discuss finally getting underway with the project for Saturday, what times would be best for everyone?
joe hill’s revenge 11/29/2022 10:40 PM
Like I said in dms anytime between 12:00am and 1:30. Benefits of a student schedule
Avatar
Skullmaggot 11/30/2022 4:29 AM
Be sure to have timezones for times since people may be all over. You can also use when2meet for help with scheduling.
Avatar
Avatar
Envy
Those who are interested in helping with the zine, I'm planning a meeting to discuss finally getting underway with the project for Saturday, what times would be best for everyone?
AldotheApache 11/30/2022 7:05 AM
After 1pm EST
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 11/30/2022 11:53 AM
Est
4:12 PM
Here is the when2meet link, if y'all could fill that out at your earliest convenience that would be helpful
Avatar
I put down my availability
12:10 PM
Will we be DM’d about the meeting location??
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/1/2022 12:11 PM
It’ll be on the discord Vc I assume
Avatar
It'll take place in the meeting room VC (edited)
Avatar
Hello everyone! I’m putting on a meeting for the creation of a zine at 11am and 2pm EST on Saturday, where we will discuss the name of the zine, how often we will put out issues, what sort of content we will put into the zine, and discussing jobs of people who wish to help. (edited)
ā¤ļø 4
Avatar
Due to unforeseen circumstances i'm gonna have to postpone the meeting, some stuff came up and I won't be able to host it today
Avatar
I'm a union writer
šŸ‘† 2
šŸ’Æ 2
Avatar
We should come up with agreeable tenants/mission statements as an activist group, and have them as a method of advertising the movement
Avatar
Avatar
horhay
We should come up with agreeable tenants/mission statements as an activist group, and have them as a method of advertising the movement
I am gonna be honest. One of my biggest frustrations with any group or party left of center is they mission statements are too nebulous. I get the idea that people want a utopia of a commune that self supports itself and all of this pie in the sky shit. It's not going to happen anytime soon, it's not realistic. And when groups form they get 1,000 people all wanting to push the goals 1,000 different directions. Then they all fight each other and fracture while the christofascists march towards their goal in almost perfect unity.
3:15 PM
The left is dog shit at organizing.
3:15 PM
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
I am gonna be honest. One of my biggest frustrations with any group or party left of center is they mission statements are too nebulous. I get the idea that people want a utopia of a commune that self supports itself and all of this pie in the sky shit. It's not going to happen anytime soon, it's not realistic. And when groups form they get 1,000 people all wanting to push the goals 1,000 different directions. Then they all fight each other and fracture while the christofascists march towards their goal in almost perfect unity.
Agree with reservations... collective consensus effort/living is possible today. The Caveat being that it has to be what our brains are wired for... so generally speaking groups of people who's primary autonomy/authority is no greater than about 20 people, and who's federated loyalty is to no more than about 200, this is how humans developed and how literally 9 million years of evolution wired our brains. Example: a collective of 15 people work/live and generally socialize primarily with one another, can decide things by consensus and not have hierarchy. They can ally via representatives they choose with about 10 - 20 other like sized collectives which can through those reps work out plans to be approved at their home collectives via consensus. That's fine. When you get to structures trying to be too big umbrella... it all breaks down.
3:23 PM
People in my experience tend to generalize on mission statements because they WANT to lead Umbrella orgs for the cred it gives them. They want to say "Yes we cover that topic" to anyone to better enlarge the group for their own personal power.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Agree with reservations... collective consensus effort/living is possible today. The Caveat being that it has to be what our brains are wired for... so generally speaking groups of people who's primary autonomy/authority is no greater than about 20 people, and who's federated loyalty is to no more than about 200, this is how humans developed and how literally 9 million years of evolution wired our brains. Example: a collective of 15 people work/live and generally socialize primarily with one another, can decide things by consensus and not have hierarchy. They can ally via representatives they choose with about 10 - 20 other like sized collectives which can through those reps work out plans to be approved at their home collectives via consensus. That's fine. When you get to structures trying to be too big umbrella... it all breaks down.
You might be right about small groups working better. I can see that something like a small group of extended family functioning well together. The problem is if you only have 15-20 people you only have that many people who can specialize in skills needed. Which means that those small groups are going to have to network and trade with other small groups. Before you know it you have a bunch of small groups creating factions and that leads us basically back to where we are now.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
People in my experience tend to generalize on mission statements because they WANT to lead Umbrella orgs for the cred it gives them. They want to say "Yes we cover that topic" to anyone to better enlarge the group for their own personal power.
And it's a bullshit way to get anything done. The more goals a group has, the more diluted each of their individual efforts become.
šŸ’Æ 1
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
You might be right about small groups working better. I can see that something like a small group of extended family functioning well together. The problem is if you only have 15-20 people you only have that many people who can specialize in skills needed. Which means that those small groups are going to have to network and trade with other small groups. Before you know it you have a bunch of small groups creating factions and that leads us basically back to where we are now.
I've actually got a functioning consensus decision-making system with federated scalability that produces consensus in 94+ % of attempts. The issue with most of what you are talking about is that some group (never one who actually identifies as non-hierarchical and egalitarian) wants power over others.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
I've actually got a functioning consensus decision-making system with federated scalability that produces consensus in 94+ % of attempts. The issue with most of what you are talking about is that some group (never one who actually identifies as non-hierarchical and egalitarian) wants power over others.
Find me any group of humans that has existed for decades where this wasn't a problem. lol
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Find me any group of humans that has existed for decades where this wasn't a problem. lol
Literally any indigenous population which qualifies as egalitarian... spanning back to 190k BC give or take. (edited)
3:27 PM
That's just humans though... ancestral hominids practiced these for over 9million years.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Literally any indigenous population which qualifies as egalitarian... spanning back to 190k BC give or take. (edited)
Has it, or do we just have gaps in history. I can't imagine many groups taking the time to write about internal power dynamics and day-to-day bullshit like that when putting together population level written or oral histories.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Has it, or do we just have gaps in history. I can't imagine many groups taking the time to write about internal power dynamics and day-to-day bullshit like that when putting together population level written or oral histories.
I'd recommend taking some Cultural Anthropology courses at the 300/400 level.
3:28 PM
Not being snarky... but the question you pose is best answered through those level courses.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
I'd recommend taking some Cultural Anthropology courses at the 300/400 level.
lol Yeah, let me just fit that into my schedule.....
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
lol Yeah, let me just fit that into my schedule.....
No I get it, it's specialized knowledge and if you really want to challenge it, I welcome you to, my mother if she were alive would challenge you to do so (as an anthropologist herself). But it can't be done with just feeling or general observation... a whole lot of very dedicated researchers into human condition and development have put a whole lot of effort into this already.
3:31 PM
Paleo-Anthropologists in particular are a special breed of researcher. Mad respect for them. I need to be able to see and talk to my research subjects.
Avatar
Yeah I totally get it with the whole ā€œwhat we strive to beā€ we’re practically just starting out here so I figured it would be simple to agree that we’re like not a gang or sell any illicit items using the iron front name, etc no actively seeking physical engagement unless under certain conditions
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
No I get it, it's specialized knowledge and if you really want to challenge it, I welcome you to, my mother if she were alive would challenge you to do so (as an anthropologist herself). But it can't be done with just feeling or general observation... a whole lot of very dedicated researchers into human condition and development have put a whole lot of effort into this already.
I don't doubt that it has been studied at all. While I haven't studied it from a strictly anthropology perspective, my undergrad was all about evolution and in particular how evolutionary pressures interfaced with human social systems. We're hardwired to select the most advantageous situation possible, and your example may very well be it..... until it's not...
Avatar
Avatar
horhay
Yeah I totally get it with the whole ā€œwhat we strive to beā€ we’re practically just starting out here so I figured it would be simple to agree that we’re like not a gang or sell any illicit items using the iron front name, etc no actively seeking physical engagement unless under certain conditions
We should not sell heroin.... 2 votes!! /lh
Avatar
I don’t trust the opps
3:33 PM
But I like activism
3:33 PM
The cointelbros
Avatar
Avatar
horhay
I don’t trust the opps
I am new to this whole leftist online thing...... "opps"?
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
I am new to this whole leftist online thing...... "opps"?
Ahaha sorry it’s not really political it’s just ā€œoppositionā€
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
I don't doubt that it has been studied at all. While I haven't studied it from a strictly anthropology perspective, my undergrad was all about evolution and in particular how evolutionary pressures interfaced with human social systems. We're hardwired to select the most advantageous situation possible, and your example may very well be it..... until it's not...
Well, let's put it this way. In hierarchical structures in pre-history humans, there is significant evidence that shows that the people at the top distributed the production of labor based on need, not the production of the individual... and leaders who did not... weren't leaders for long.
Avatar
Avatar
horhay
Ahaha sorry it’s not really political it’s just ā€œoppositionā€
Ok. I didn't know if you had a particular group in mind.
šŸ’Æ 1
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Well, let's put it this way. In hierarchical structures in pre-history humans, there is significant evidence that shows that the people at the top distributed the production of labor based on need, not the production of the individual... and leaders who did not... weren't leaders for long.
Absolutely. Leaders who did shitty things got shanked. 100%.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Absolutely. Leaders who did shitty things got shanked. 100%.
And there is little evidence that leaders were common, rather they were actually seemingly rare or non-existant in cultures... exceptions being in times when someone guided a group through something based on skill or ingenuity... but even then most of the time those people went back to being just average joes after the crisis was over. (edited)
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
And there is little evidence that leaders were common, rather they were actually seemingly rare or non-existant in cultures... exceptions being in times when someone guided a group through something based on skill or ingenuity... but even then most of the time those people went back to being just average joes after the crisis was over. (edited)
But here's my whole point. We went from what you're describing to where we are today. So there aren't any social guardrails that are strong enough to keep that from happening again.
3:39 PM
Well..... I guess I am not sure what your overall goal is.
3:39 PM
That makes a big difference, and I may be assuming some things you're not meaning.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
But here's my whole point. We went from what you're describing to where we are today. So there aren't any social guardrails that are strong enough to keep that from happening again.
Genetics... we've not adapted to the existing state of capitalist hierarchy... we're still more or less hominids from 100k years ago... this is evidenced by the extremely high prevalence of depression, anxiety, loneliness, poor self esteem... etc.
3:40 PM
Our guardrail against making mistakes as egalitarian collectives... genetics. It's our wiring.
3:40 PM
We literally get high when we help others.
3:40 PM
That mechanism still exists.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Our guardrail against making mistakes as egalitarian collectives... genetics. It's our wiring.
No..... We still got to this point with largely the same genome.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
No..... We still got to this point with largely the same genome.
The average people are not the oligarchy which demanded these structures we have.
Avatar
And I would argue that capitalism isn't something a species can adapt to. We see the negative effects of resource hoarding on populations all through nature.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
And I would argue that capitalism isn't something a species can adapt to. We see the negative effects of resource hoarding on populations all through nature.
Won't argue with that.
Avatar
Walk me through this. What is your end goal?
Avatar
A progression using viable cultural evolution methods towards a more egalitarian world.
3:42 PM
There is no utopia... just a progress towards better structures.
Avatar
So what would my life as an American look like? What role if any would government play?
Avatar
Enough progress and there can be utopic aspects... but utopia is a fallacy.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Enough progress and there can be utopic aspects... but utopia is a fallacy.
Agreed. Which is why a lot of these people make my brain sad and hurty. (edited)
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
So what would my life as an American look like? What role if any would government play?
In the next 5 years it's possible that your life could look like living with a group of friends/chosen family, where 80% of your basic needs are met within that group. Some luxuries as well... more luxuries and the other 20% would be met by agreed upon trade with other groups like that.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Agreed. Which is why a lot of these people make my brain sad and hurty. (edited)
Felt
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
So what would my life as an American look like? What role if any would government play?
In fact my personal life's work is specifically making those living conditions possible for as many groups as possible.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
In the next 5 years it's possible that your life could look like living with a group of friends/chosen family, where 80% of your basic needs are met within that group. Some luxuries as well... more luxuries and the other 20% would be met by agreed upon trade with other groups like that.
All due respect. We can't mobilize people to vote unless the very essence of democracy is at stake. How are we going to convince a sizeable portion of the population to topple all of the major corps that we depend on to survive? Like I get the end goal, it's great. But no one has ever been able to lay out an even realistic plan to get there.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
So what would my life as an American look like? What role if any would government play?
As far as what role government will play... We work with what we have, and avoid as much government as possible. While also showing others what the benefits of living like that are.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
All due respect. We can't mobilize people to vote unless the very essence of democracy is at stake. How are we going to convince a sizeable portion of the population to topple all of the major corps that we depend on to survive? Like I get the end goal, it's great. But no one has ever been able to lay out an even realistic plan to get there.
I think you are thinking too macro.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
I think you are thinking too macro.
Maybe I am.
Avatar
There is no macro in humanity. When you look to controlling humanity on that level you lose perspective on humanity.
3:48 PM
And thus you are right... this is why Marxism failed and became bastardizations of itself like Maoism and Marxist Leninism.
3:52 PM
This is also why people like the Zapatista (who have been in successful rebellion against Mexico officially since 1994 and organizing for that rebellion together since 1983) thanked Marxists for their ideas but told them to keep their noses out of it. And structured their authority at the pueblo level with alliance with other EZLN aligned pueblos. (circling back to your asking me to point to a group that has been in existence for a long time without breaking down) In doing this they have gone from the most impoverished illiterate area of Mexico with the poorest healthcare and education, to the highest rate of literacy, best access to healthcare, and fastest growing education system... and along with that one of the highest infrastructure growth rates in the world.
3:54 PM
Also keep in mind that this population is made up of the most disenfranchised population in Mexico made up of mostly Mayan descendent communities. (edited)
3:55 PM
All that said... what worked for them won't work in Arizona... or Colorado... or even specific areas of those states. Individual groups will have to make their structure fit their people.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Also keep in mind that this population is made up of the most disenfranchised population in Mexico made up of mostly Mayan descendent communities. (edited)
This does not surprise me at all. Leadership is historically best done by the poorest in a society.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
This does not surprise me at all. Leadership is historically best done by the poorest in a society.
in this case also at the lowest level. In nearly all decisions they strive for consensus. They keep working on adapting their models for a challenge till they have consensus.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
All that said... what worked for them won't work in Arizona... or Colorado... or even specific areas of those states. Individual groups will have to make their structure fit their people.
Ok. So again, maybe I am letting the bad taste of edgy Hot Topic teenage leftists cloud my perspective here...... I guess this is the one question that will help me clarify your meaning the most. We would still support municipal and state level government doing things like providing clean water...?
šŸ‘† 1
Avatar
And not just consensus of men, or elders, but of the whole community which chooses to participate in the decision.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Ok. So again, maybe I am letting the bad taste of edgy Hot Topic teenage leftists cloud my perspective here...... I guess this is the one question that will help me clarify your meaning the most. We would still support municipal and state level government doing things like providing clean water...?
The answer is... in some places that will be necessary. In some places it will be largely an individual collective project or a project associated with multiple adjacent collectives.
3:59 PM
My point is... let's take the Arkansas River Valley area of Colorado (Buena Vista, Salida etc). Even within that small a region there would be multiple answers to that question.
3:59 PM
Hell in the existing system there already are.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Hell in the existing system there already are.
True
Avatar
Many people are off grid, many participate in the electrical co-op, many have city wastewater treatment, many have septic. Many have rainwater catchment and a well. Many have treated city water.
4:00 PM
That won't change... there is no one size fits all answer.
Avatar
This is my concern whenever I hear someone say things like this. Often times their answer to everything is "well just burn the system down and get rid of all the governments, government is evil". Completely neglecting the wake of dead bodies that will leave behind.
Avatar
What might/will (by necessity) change in the long run is more options become available to tackle those problems. Right now compost toilets are prohibited... but they are the absolutely best water conservation means of treating human waste. (edited)
Avatar
Again, I am probably tainted by "Leftists" who have no idea of what the world outside their suburb is like talking out of their ass.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
This is my concern whenever I hear someone say things like this. Often times their answer to everything is "well just burn the system down and get rid of all the governments, government is evil". Completely neglecting the wake of dead bodies that will leave behind.
You are talking to a 45 year old Anarchist with at least 38 years of deep dive into cultural anthropology and 20+ years of sustainability, and who worked on the problem of viable consensus procedures for most of my life.
4:04 PM
I went through my radical beat the fuck out of everyone stage at 15-18 before I joined the military and saw what real violence was.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Again, I am probably tainted by "Leftists" who have no idea of what the world outside their suburb is like talking out of their ass.
Everyone starts from a point of realizing there is a problem, and as they are figuring it out they get angry. I get it, I was there.
4:06 PM
I'm still angry, but I know a lot more about what doesn't work... some about what does/will work... and try to find more of the latter, and avoid more of the former.
šŸ‘ 1
4:13 PM
More on infrastructure. We've got lefties who are specifically in IT for the purpose of developing decentralized replacements of the internet... also new versions of wide access wifi that don't depend on centralized state or corporate apparatus. So... back to your question... yes, infrastructure projects will still occur, what scale and what technologies are used will by necessity differ from place to place, group to group and even family to family. We may have to reinvent the wheel so to speak... but that's actually where non-hierarchical collectives and federations of those collectives thrive. Because that's what makes us human... our ingenuity particularly to resolve complex problems with limited resources.
4:15 PM
When societal structures limit our ability to adapt, such as local governments placing restrictions on the adoption of new techniques and technology (or even old ones developed by indigenous people modernized by new technology like compost toilets) we suffer.
Avatar
It is certainly a good goal to work towards.
Avatar
Side note: Local governments place those restrictions for numerous reasons, but usually those reasons are financial influence. A city councilman with a brother or cousin or friend who is a septic system company owner... or a well drilling company owner.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
Side note: Local governments place those restrictions for numerous reasons, but usually those reasons are financial influence. A city councilman with a brother or cousin or friend who is a septic system company owner... or a well drilling company owner.
100% this.
4:17 PM
Regulatory capture is something nobody talks about enough.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
It is certainly a good goal to work towards.
I can do it today. Not on a large scale... but I can provide sustainability at 80% to 10-15 people for less than 200k.
4:18 PM
Furthermore I can gift those 10-15 people with a proven successful consensus structure. And I can assist them in adapting it to them specifically.
4:18 PM
And doing so within the regulations placed upon it by local government.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
I can do it today. Not on a large scale... but I can provide sustainability at 80% to 10-15 people for less than 200k.
Where could you pull this off? Does it work better in rural areas for example? Or could this be done in a suburb?
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
Where could you pull this off? Does it work better in rural areas for example? Or could this be done in a suburb?
The construction plan I have is for a rural area (specifically Costilla county Colorado). But while the price would change, I could adapt it (with some outside help) to more suburban or urban environments. One of the first projects I worked on was an innercity housing co-op that aimed for 60% sustainability 20 years ago. The pricetag was monumental however.
4:21 PM
Also I hadn't figured out the pieces of the consensus puzzle at that point.
4:22 PM
Adaptation to a specific area outside of Costilla County Colorado would take about a month.
4:26 PM
At least to come up with the main points. With a team working on it, we could probably develop hard plans/blueprints for a wide variety of scenarios within a few months.
4:28 PM
The main issue with more suburban and urban environments is actually not zoning regulations (though some sustainability will be lost to those), it's property price. Construction costs remain relatively the same, infrastructure costs too... but 5 acres within a suburb is hard to find, and harder to zone properly, and costs in the millions. Where as rural areas 5 acres can be as low as 5000.
Avatar
I figured property price would be a massively limiting factor.
Avatar
Avatar
CopperTop
I figured property price would be a massively limiting factor.
It is the number one limiting factor. Hands down. It primarily effects size of the property, which limits number of people and sustainability regardless of zoning rules which further do so. That said... it's foolish to attempt to do such collectives beyond 20-30 people anyway. We're just not wired to see more than that as individuals. And it's just asking for conflict and schism. Ideally we're talking 10-20 people at most. Also ideally, with allies who can take in people who don't mesh well with the first one they try to become a part of. Voluntary association is critical. It's also in my opinion the biggest freedom we don't have thanks to capitalism. (edited)
4:40 PM
That said... even just 10 people having 80% sustainable lifetime residences for a cost of 20,000 per person is an incredible value from a fiscal model. There are some sacrifices... such as not having a traditional lumber construction home... but the sacrifices are trades for sustainability and in fact durability. Earthbag construction homes with adobe or cob exterior and interior walls are incredibly thermally efficient, and some people think they are better looking. In addition they are monumentally cheaper to build if your collective is putting in the labor themselves.
4:41 PM
I think I figured 30 days per 20 foot diameter residence with 10 people working on it at 6 hours a day. (I'd have to reference my docs for the specific time, but that's a good ballpark, weather, injury, and even just someone who needs time off will change it dramatically anyway.) (edited)
Avatar
Idea: put epic conversations like this one in the zine
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/7/2022 7:31 PM
Idea, comics section but it’s just memes
Avatar
Avatar
Steve Mike
Idea: put epic conversations like this one in the zine
My consent to that is given.
Avatar
Just make up Zine characters to change the names.
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
To be fair Spinner is sort of a character. I certainly don't go around using that name IRL.
Avatar
AIF Cuirassier regiment 12/7/2022 9:56 PM
good
Avatar
Yeah I changed it when I decided that Thomas Paine was a little too presumptuous.
10:05 PM
Though I still have ambitions to update the language and context of his work.
10:05 PM
Maybe someday.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
That said... even just 10 people having 80% sustainable lifetime residences for a cost of 20,000 per person is an incredible value from a fiscal model. There are some sacrifices... such as not having a traditional lumber construction home... but the sacrifices are trades for sustainability and in fact durability. Earthbag construction homes with adobe or cob exterior and interior walls are incredibly thermally efficient, and some people think they are better looking. In addition they are monumentally cheaper to build if your collective is putting in the labor themselves.
LessthanLoneWolf 12/8/2022 1:44 AM
If you have an adequate woodlot on a property, you could have lumber supports. If you cut the trees right, they’ll grow multiple trunks, and provide firewood several years in the future
šŸ’Æ 2
Avatar
Avatar
LessthanLoneWolf
If you have an adequate woodlot on a property, you could have lumber supports. If you cut the trees right, they’ll grow multiple trunks, and provide firewood several years in the future
Absolutely, not just firewood, but also wood for crafts/furniture. Even to make biochar. Having a community or two in the network with properly husbanded trees would be an invaluable asset to the whole. That was actually why the first one I designed was going to be in the Montana Rockies.
Avatar
LessthanLoneWolf 12/8/2022 2:01 AM
One of the reasons I moved to the woods; self sustainability. Havent don’t anything yet with my woods, but learned you can have a lot of quail/chickens on a small (but still ethical) space
šŸ‘ 3
Avatar
Avatar
Steve Mike
Idea: put epic conversations like this one in the zine
That's fine by me. Just use a different name, I have a fair bit tied to this one.
Avatar
Yeah this is just an idea proposed, we should definitely all think about it, take a vote perhaps. And I agree, we should not use actual screen names.
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/9/2022 1:52 PM
@Envy is there a meeting tomorrow
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/9/2022 2:49 PM
What time?
Avatar
11am and 2pm EST, same as last time
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/9/2022 3:25 PM
I not might be able to make them, or I might only be on briefly
Avatar
Alright, I can send you the meeting notes if you want afterward
Avatar
Skullmaggot 12/9/2022 11:50 PM
@spacewolf05 also check out the zine
Avatar
AldotheApache 12/10/2022 11:07 AM
@Envy where is the meeting being held? (edited)
Avatar
Meeting is being held in the meeting room VC
Avatar
Just realized I'm the one that missed the 11am meeting, and now I'm a fool. 2pm EST meeting is still on, apologies for missing the first one
12:19 PM
I'm operating out of CST and didn't convert the time
Avatar
AldotheApache 12/10/2022 1:04 PM
All good. See you at 2pm.
3:12 PM
Meeting notes from today, feel free to discuss or bring up anything you want to add
šŸ‘ 2
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 12/10/2022 9:16 PM
@Envy do you think we could include images from the flyer drive in the first issue?
Avatar
We could probably do that
Avatar
If you can, people working on the zine please make an account on cryptpad, as we will be using that for collaborative documents.
šŸ‘ 1
3:56 AM
End-to-end encrypted collaboration suite
3:57 AM
Debating on whether we should continue using discord for communication or switch to signal/element as well, though that is less paramount.
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/5/2023 5:07 PM
Just putting in here that vibeshifter is planning to work on the zine.
Avatar
Avatar
Skullmaggot
Just putting in here that vibeshifter is planning to work on the zine.
joe hill’s revenge 2/7/2023 5:56 PM
Working on@the first article
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 2/17/2023 7:43 PM
first draft
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
first draft
Skullmaggot 2/17/2023 11:27 PM
Alright to go over this soon? (Though, probably not today.) I have questions about specifics and sources, and (in my limited knowledge of editing) I would want to go over its argumentative format. Also, I believe Steve Mike said the best thing to do would be to use a different service that's already made for blogging, and then link the website to that. I'd also be simultaneous wanting to connect best I can with various antifascist media--let's see if we can get a cycle of media and engagement going.
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/17/2023 11:37 PM
@Spinner I like thinking of things from a fundamental perspective to create processes by which something can be self-sufficient. We talked about breadtube the other day. For my own sake, what would you say are the fundamental differences between breadtube, and say, reddit posts (e.g. r/ACAB), particularly towards encouraging coordinated actions? Or, what's the difference between unpopular and popular breadtubers, even if they are about self-promotion? What creates a cycle of engagement? I was watching this the other day on recuperation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ucF2IeJTfE .
11:39 PM
Actually, specifically I'm looking at 10:40 onwards at the "domain of culture." (edited)
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/17/2023 11:50 PM
I want to bring in antifascist news sources. Like, link them on the sight and encourage some viewership. (edited)
Avatar
Avatar
Skullmaggot
joe hill’s revenge 2/18/2023 1:49 AM
What are these?
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
What are these?
Skullmaggot 2/18/2023 1:51 AM
Blog spaces. I made a post above about how we would probably find a blog site for zine articles and link that in the Iron Front website.
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
What are these?
Skullmaggot 2/18/2023 1:52 AM
Oh, I should say that they are also free.
Avatar
Avatar
Skullmaggot
@Spinner I like thinking of things from a fundamental perspective to create processes by which something can be self-sufficient. We talked about breadtube the other day. For my own sake, what would you say are the fundamental differences between breadtube, and say, reddit posts (e.g. r/ACAB), particularly towards encouraging coordinated actions? Or, what's the difference between unpopular and popular breadtubers, even if they are about self-promotion? What creates a cycle of engagement? I was watching this the other day on recuperation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ucF2IeJTfE .
This person from 10:40 on, sorta nails it. Popular youtube platforms only popular figures... a feedback loop creates more viewership for both. Whereas youtubers who platform people who don't have an algorithmic presence don't get that feedback loop driving more viewers to their site. Even mentioning particular popular names repeatedly through a video will create that feedback loop, but the opposite will not. And all the popular ones use the technique outlined in that clip... stating opinion as fact without allowing room for alternative opinions or overtly shitting on alternative opinions (even better if you shit on semi-popular content creators, but smaller unpopular ones will help a little too). It's not specific to breadtube, you'll find the same in nearly all content creators (comedy and music youtube aside). This isn't to say that a person cannot get popular and have a legitimate message (Beau of the Fifth Column pops into mind) but they have to have satisfy all kinds of other algorithmic check boxes to do so... In Beau's case he always films from the same location, has an opening tagline spoken at the very start of every single video, even wears the same outfit (with the exception of changing t-shirt where the graphic on the shirt fits the theme of the video), and probably a hundred other little things I'm not aware of. And they must, absolutely must, have viewership engagement (which is what Beau has in spite of not following the wealthy breadtuber mandate of platforming other popular breadtubers and shitting on unpopular ones). Beau, Twinrabbit, and a couple other breadtubers are excellent examples of beneficial polar opposites from Vaush, Shoeonhead, and their ilk who are very clearly only interested in creating content to elevate their capitalist status.
4:06 AM
Some beneficial techniques that I don't see as toxic include... Short videos (less than 10 minutes) several times a day (if possible, at least one a day if not). Consistent format, same opening tagline, same visual setting, even the same pacing (tagline, opening statement, expansion on the statement, correlation with similar things, conclusion, outro). Finding a "humorous" voice. Engagement in videos increases exponentially with humor (which is why most popular breadtubers shit on others so much... they make jokes at others expense which is the easiest form of humor). (edited)
4:09 AM
Some beneficial toxic techniques to stay away from: Shitting on others for a laugh. Making extreme offhand comments. (Vaush and Shoe both were relatively unknown till they made really offensive offhand comments which generated viewership from the outrage. Both cases included sex with underage individuals.)
4:11 AM
Platforming popular content creators to the exclusion of basically everyone and everything. (Revolutionary Black Network, and Left Flank Veterans both did/do this, and of course Vaush and Shoe do it as well.)
4:13 AM
All in all... creating content is valuable to a project, necessary even... but only if the goal is not the popularity but rather dissemination of information. Intention matters. That said... being a content creator is inherently a dopamine/oxytocin/serotonin tap. It's really really easy to get caught up chasing the highs, and doing everything to avoid the lows.
4:18 AM
Once upon a time we were spending all month crafting a zine which we would print a hundred copies of at Kinkos, cut, staple, fold, and hand out. We might get one person to contact us after the fact through our borrowed CalTech email account. We'd spend 3 hours uploading it to a BBS via dialup through a hacked sprintnet modem in case someone somewhere else might want to use it. It was more or less a labor of love, with no more reward than knowing someone might read what we wrote and have a view changed because of it. Now it's like tapping a vein and shooting yourself up with dopamine... and crashing when the engagement isn't there. (edited)
4:24 AM
All that said. I don't see how it can be anything like self sufficient. Every video needs to be written, edited, then recorded, then video/sound edited, post production effects added, then posted online. My wife spends 5-10 hours on any simple video, and one she did while learning took over a month at 3-4 hours a day.
4:25 AM
Even just filming the video can take ten times as long as the final cut or more.
4:26 AM
Multiple people working on the task can make it take less time overall... but the labor hours will be there regardless of if it's one or many people working on it.
šŸ‘ 2
Avatar
Avatar
Skullmaggot
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/18/2023 4:48 AM
Funny, I was looking into starting an antifascist news blog myself.
4:48 AM
Thanks.
Avatar
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy
Funny, I was looking into starting an antifascist news blog myself.
Skullmaggot 2/19/2023 1:35 AM
One of the things I do want to go over is entropy and how having too many spaces and media and channels can dilute people into ineffectiveness. The internet is infinitely expansive, and it separates people into lonesome boxes. I’d rather create a software that keeps the internet tight and promotes synchronous local interaction. I’d just warn about creating more spaces, but more space can also be mitigated by directing your readers to a blog more popular than your own.
Avatar
GreaverBlade 2/21/2023 9:56 PM
@joe hill’s revenge Heya, Skullmaggot suggested I reach out. I'd like to help with editing the zine if still needed.
Avatar
Avatar
GreaverBlade
@joe hill’s revenge Heya, Skullmaggot suggested I reach out. I'd like to help with editing the zine if still needed.
joe hill’s revenge 2/21/2023 10:14 PM
Hi
Avatar
Avatar
GreaverBlade
@joe hill’s revenge Heya, Skullmaggot suggested I reach out. I'd like to help with editing the zine if still needed.
joe hill’s revenge 2/21/2023 11:38 PM
It is absolutely still needed!
11:40 PM
I just want to warn you that zines are a lot of work, and require a lot of time. What experience do you have with editing?
Avatar
GreaverBlade 2/22/2023 12:42 AM
I'm an IT Security auditor and amateur writer. Nitpicking is my profession. But if you need a real editor, I'd happily stand aside.
Avatar
Avatar
GreaverBlade
I'm an IT Security auditor and amateur writer. Nitpicking is my profession. But if you need a real editor, I'd happily stand aside.
joe hill’s revenge 2/22/2023 1:19 AM
We literally need anyone who is willing to help
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/22/2023 4:45 PM
Lol, but yeah!
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/23/2023 6:40 PM
I've got some writing experience from my old space news blog.
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/23/2023 6:41 PM
As a reminder, there are a number of graphic designers who would be looking for something to make. I’m typically too busy to hand out assignments and make revisions, but if anybody is willing to put in the time for such, there is that resource.
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/24/2023 9:17 PM
@Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy @joe hill’s revenge Just letting you know that TheAnonymousDew wants to get an information campaign—propaganda—going, and I think we can roll things together with other forms of media that we’re trying to set up now. I think you should also involve ☈ ☈#1190, who seems aligned with these projects and can do graphic design. Overall, I want to determine what process we can draft up for what we want to create, and we also can convene upon a narrower list of topics so that we’re not too spread out in what we’re trying to do. I’m also trying to get Sinned but but we’ll see.
šŸ‘ 3
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/25/2023 12:57 AM
Are we looking to do well-researched articles, viral propaganda, subreddit posts, all the above?
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/25/2023 1:21 AM
I'm better at doing articles personally but I'll try my hand at the others if I need to.
1:23 AM
Also, if there's anyone here that uses aktivix.org or riseup.net that can help me get an account on them or knows anyone that can, dm me.
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 2/25/2023 7:01 PM
Me and @GreaverBlade tentatively planned to hold a zine meeting after the next general meeting
7:01 PM
If there are a lot of interested people right now, maybe we could meet on Vc sooner
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
Me and @GreaverBlade tentatively planned to hold a zine meeting after the next general meeting
Skullmaggot 2/26/2023 4:23 AM
This may be short notice, but I am unsure of my availability next Sunday 3/5. It’s not a set thing yet, but you might have to have the meeting without me. I definitely want to hear of what you got, so take notes please.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
This person from 10:40 on, sorta nails it. Popular youtube platforms only popular figures... a feedback loop creates more viewership for both. Whereas youtubers who platform people who don't have an algorithmic presence don't get that feedback loop driving more viewers to their site. Even mentioning particular popular names repeatedly through a video will create that feedback loop, but the opposite will not. And all the popular ones use the technique outlined in that clip... stating opinion as fact without allowing room for alternative opinions or overtly shitting on alternative opinions (even better if you shit on semi-popular content creators, but smaller unpopular ones will help a little too). It's not specific to breadtube, you'll find the same in nearly all content creators (comedy and music youtube aside). This isn't to say that a person cannot get popular and have a legitimate message (Beau of the Fifth Column pops into mind) but they have to have satisfy all kinds of other algorithmic check boxes to do so... In Beau's case he always films from the same location, has an opening tagline spoken at the very start of every single video, even wears the same outfit (with the exception of changing t-shirt where the graphic on the shirt fits the theme of the video), and probably a hundred other little things I'm not aware of. And they must, absolutely must, have viewership engagement (which is what Beau has in spite of not following the wealthy breadtuber mandate of platforming other popular breadtubers and shitting on unpopular ones). Beau, Twinrabbit, and a couple other breadtubers are excellent examples of beneficial polar opposites from Vaush, Shoeonhead, and their ilk who are very clearly only interested in creating content to elevate their capitalist status.
Beau of the Fifth Column was convicted for people smuggling. He literally trafficked Eastern European women into the USA for exploitation.
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID] 2/26/2023 6:20 PM
WHAT
6:25 PM
does a three minute google search finds out he was literally just a coyote with voluntary people, spent a significant amount of time in jail, and has both repented for it and done a lot of good to counteract what he did
šŸ‘† 1
6:26 PM
seems like it's drummed up shit to discredit him
Avatar
Repented? He's lied about it and said he was doing "refugee recovery" from "bad countries"
6:42 PM
He also got purposefully let off by the feds when he could've gotten over 65 years
Avatar
BadEmpanada made a great video
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 7:58 PM
137 votes and 372 comments so far on Reddit
Avatar
Avatar
bob10101
Repented? He's lied about it and said he was doing "refugee recovery" from "bad countries"
floppunism [BOI, ID] 2/26/2023 8:01 PM
voluntary smuggling from eastern europe sounds exactly like refugee recovery from bad countries lmao
Avatar
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID]
voluntary smuggling from eastern europe sounds exactly like refugee recovery from bad countries lmao
Voluntary is questionable, given that they were sold a lie and then forced to do entirely other things
Avatar
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy
Whatever these comments, I doubt personally that he is so vile, because other youtubers who don't get accused of being vile talk with him normally, if he were so vile these people wouldn't want to be around him would they?
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 8:42 PM
I don't trust anyone who spreads blood libel.
Avatar
Look, I don't care what you think about him, I'm saying that if he is really as terrible as some people claim, then why do people such as yugopnik, notably not condemned as a "tankie", hang with him? (edited)
Avatar
Avatar
bob10101
Look, I don't care what you think about him, I'm saying that if he is really as terrible as some people claim, then why do people such as yugopnik, notably not condemned as a "tankie", hang with him? (edited)
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 9:42 PM
I do not know who that is nor do I care.
Avatar
Ok?
Avatar
@bob10101 this the same person that claims because I was too poor to get out of gangland LA and go to college any other way than joining the military that makes me a fucking Nazi. Yeah this person has about as much cred as fucking Shoe. I'm gonna need a lot more information about what Beau did from other sources there bud.
Avatar
Maybe his actual indictment and a testimony from one of the women linked in the comments?
11:20 PM
You can get all that from the blogspot link
11:22 PM
Also the fact that he was already called about before this by MikefromPA, who was then attacked by multiple "leftist" youtubers (edited)
Avatar
I'll look into it more... but both your sources are... sensationalist to say the least. Also... MikefromPA doesn't link any quotes he attributes to "Beau". Also 15 years is a lot of time to "come to Jesus" on shit you did in the past. Also... people don't owe strangers explanations on their own past mistakes. They owe it to people to make good choices regarding them going on from when they realized they made them. I've done enough shit to earn my place in hell regardless of what I have done or will do from then on. Doesn't mean I'm going to tell the world what I did to deserve my place in hell, nor what those things are that I work every day to counter with good. What I care about in left media... is what their message is, and do they platform people who do "good shit" tm. So far the two you have mentioned seem to be only all about shitting on others.
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID] 2/26/2023 11:50 PM
and tbh? i don’t really care if he did bad shit or not. he certainly isn’t doing it anymore, he did it a long time ago (and hint: people change) and his videos are extremely useful.
11:51 PM
it’s like rejecting mobile warfare tactics because they matured under hitler’s command, or deep battle tactics because it came to be under stalin
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 11:51 PM
https://youtu.be/6eOZ7YsicSM And because being an antisemite wasn't enough, he's also a tankie.
whatthefuckman 3
11:52 PM
Thanks to @archon for pointing this out to me.
Avatar
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID]
and tbh? i don’t really care if he did bad shit or not. he certainly isn’t doing it anymore, he did it a long time ago (and hint: people change) and his videos are extremely useful.
Particularly useful since he puts things in a way that can/and has gotten through the cognitive dissonance of the manipulated poor white southern class.
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 11:54 PM
Empanada is at best a terminally online moron who needs to touch some grass and at worst a hateful psychopath who furthers the interest of tyrants because they're against the US.
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID] 2/26/2023 11:55 PM
imperialism is when the US or israel has foreign policy i don’t like (edited)
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/26/2023 11:55 PM
Either way, he can suck my dick and choke on it.
Avatar
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy
Empanada is at best a terminally online moron who needs to touch some grass and at worst a hateful psychopath who furthers the interest of tyrants because they're against the US.
I mean sure, but I'm more interested in the point regarding Beau... Now if someone were to come forward to claim he was pulling off stolen valor... and had some evidence to support it... that would be a little more damning. Because I know a half dozen guys his age or older who did what he did... and there is more to the story than what was written about that trial in the SPLC document MikefromPA quoted from.
11:59 PM
Those three Russians convicted with him... they were absolutely not the top folks in the operation. This smells like something the Feds cooked up to try to sort out Russian Mafia influence in the US... and then the Sherriff's stumbled on it.
12:01 AM
There is also the possibility that "Beau" is telling the truth, while not telling the whole truth. Among those who he brought over, could very well be some who were seeking refuge permanently. In order to operate such a project you've got to have a cover.
12:02 AM
I don't know... but I do know enough to know I don't know enough.
Avatar
Avatar
Spinner
I mean sure, but I'm more interested in the point regarding Beau... Now if someone were to come forward to claim he was pulling off stolen valor... and had some evidence to support it... that would be a little more damning. Because I know a half dozen guys his age or older who did what he did... and there is more to the story than what was written about that trial in the SPLC document MikefromPA quoted from.
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/27/2023 12:02 AM
The point I'm trying to make here is that someone who supports blatantly tyrannical regimes simply because they call themselves "leftists" and are against the US while also spewing antisemitic rhetoric is not what I would call a "reliable source".
Avatar
And it sure as hell isn't gonna be someone like Bad Empenada, or MikefromPA who's gonna give me all the missing info.
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 2/27/2023 12:03 AM
So I'm taking this with an entire salt mine.
Avatar
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy
The point I'm trying to make here is that someone who supports blatantly tyrannical regimes simply because they call themselves "leftists" and are against the US while also spewing antisemitic rhetoric is not what I would call a "reliable source".
You are absolutely correct. Particularly because Beau advocates in total opposition to his tankie dogma.
12:05 AM
Discredit your political rivals with anything including lies and half truths is literally out of the Lenin playbook.
Avatar
Skullmaggot 2/28/2023 2:48 AM
@joe hill’s revenge Just saying that I should be free to do the regular meeting and even hopefully catch you for the zine after meeting.
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 3/2/2023 7:11 PM
Florida Sen. Jason Brodeur (R-Lake Mary) wants bloggers who write about Gov. Ron DeSantis, Attorney General Ashley Moody, and other members of the Florida executive cabinet or legislature to regist…
Avatar
I smell overreach
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 3/2/2023 7:36 PM
And first amendment violations.
Avatar
Also airlines losses
Avatar
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy
https://youtu.be/6eOZ7YsicSM And because being an antisemite wasn't enough, he's also a tankie.
hes an idiot
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/7/2023 10:21 PM
@GreaverBlade what do you think the mission statement should say?
Avatar
GreaverBlade 3/8/2023 12:36 AM
"Our mission is to raise awareness, develop conversations, and instill a righteous fury to oppose authoritarianism in all its forms."
šŸ‘ 3
Avatar
Avatar
GreaverBlade
"Our mission is to raise awareness, develop conversations, and instill a righteous fury to oppose authoritarianism in all its forms."
joe hill’s revenge 3/10/2023 7:26 PM
Sounds good, can you help edit some articles im working on?
Avatar
GreaverBlade 3/10/2023 7:35 PM
Yup, just DM them over.
Avatar
CaulPartBallMop 3/10/2023 7:50 PM
Do we have a researcher role specifically for the zine? I think I could be useful in verifying the validity/scholarship of sources and or looking into claims within works as an editor to verify by source... Does that make sense? I saw earlier in the chat that y'all were using cryptpad and I can make an account for that and such but I wanted to run the idea by y'all before being presumptuous
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/16/2023 5:43 PM
Would it be ok if I shared some article ideas here, until my compute gets fixed abd I can share documents
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/16/2023 5:53 PM
  • need for a new deal
  • modern fascism vs old fascism
  • history of American iron front
  • how to do activism
  • upcoming protests and actions
5:54 PM
  • something on the rights attack on education and ā€œwokismā€
  • something on left wing gun culture
5:54 PM
Honestly I’ve got so many ideas
Avatar
could you elaborate on left wing gun culture and the new deal? Im not entirely sure what you mean by those.
Avatar
Avatar
grAvity
could you elaborate on left wing gun culture and the new deal? Im not entirely sure what you mean by those.
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 3/16/2023 11:06 PM
Good examples of left wing gun culture include groups like the Socialist Rifle Association, John Brown Gun Club, Pink Pistols, and Redneck Revolt among others. They're by no means perfect, but the culture they promote is one more about defense of yourself and others from threats instead of the usual right-wing chuddery.
šŸ‘ 3
Avatar
imo, Pink Pistols and John Brown seem to be the most consistent.
12:20 AM
SRA are inconsistent as shit. Some states got really good chapters, some don't have them or really REALLY weak ones. RedNeck revolt is also pretty splintered as well
Avatar
Skullmaggot 3/17/2023 1:20 AM
We also ought to be asking all our members about what articles they'd like to see written up.
šŸ’Æ 1
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 3/17/2023 11:07 PM
What platform is the zine going to be on?
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/17/2023 11:41 PM
The website?
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 3/17/2023 11:56 PM
I forgot we had one lol.
Avatar
Avatar
grAvity
could you elaborate on left wing gun culture and the new deal? Im not entirely sure what you mean by those.
CaulPartBallMop 3/19/2023 12:08 PM
To answer The New Deal part of your question The original new deal came from FDR and established a lot of welfare/prosperity programs we know today back in the great depression. There have been several depressions/recessions since and we haven't gotten another movement like that, more like the opposite. So like... A NEW New Deal
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/24/2023 1:29 PM
I’ll post some articles later today
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/26/2023 4:21 PM
My computer finally came out of the shop! I’m gonna jump@on the zine this week
4:21 PM
My goal is to release issue 1 by the end of April with 4-6 articles
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet 3/30/2023 4:08 PM
Can we submit our own essays here as potential articles?
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 3/30/2023 4:42 PM
Yes of course
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
Yes of course
I’d also be interested in submitting essays. Out of the ideas you suggested, are there any you aren’t working on that I could write or do I need to bring my own ideas?
Avatar
Avatar
OPRacoon
I’d also be interested in submitting essays. Out of the ideas you suggested, are there any you aren’t working on that I could write or do I need to bring my own ideas?
joe hill’s revenge 4/1/2023 12:28 PM
I’d say that any of them are good, especially since we can get two perspectives
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/3/2023 12:39 AM
I recently got someone to send me this layout for a simple Zine.
12:39 AM
I started on a join AIF zine immediately, its incomplete:
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/3/2023 1:51 PM
@Skullmaggot @GreaverBlade @Aces high
1:51 PM
@DevilTheAutopoet
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet 4/3/2023 3:26 PM
I think I'll write an essay about the right's attack on education and "wokism". I'll frame it through the lens of analysis of Orwell's 1984, talk about how the right abuses concepts and terms from the book, and talk about how to actually analyse education in the US through an Orwellian lens, how doing so lends itself to analytical methods such as CRT and Queer Theory, and how those very methods are being used by the right to fearmonger and attack even basic education of history and social studies. I also might write an essay on left wing gun culture, but I haven't gotten as far in figuring out how I want to frame it yet.
šŸ”„ 1
Avatar
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 4/3/2023 3:35 PM
currently banging out my essay on Rome
Avatar
Thinking about doing an essay on the need for a successful ā€œThird Reconstructionā€ as advocated for by the Poor People’s Campaign
6:56 PM
Would be more informative than analytical
6:56 PM
Still need to research and iron out details
Avatar
RebelKitty 4/3/2023 8:18 PM
I'm debating doing one too. I like writing quite a lot, actually. Been researching Knowlton's Rangers and "special forces" of the American Revolution for a potential subject.
šŸ”„ 1
Avatar
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 4/3/2023 8:18 PM
Go for it
8:19 PM
This is why I don’t want to be the main history columnist; a lotta y’all know way more about shit than me
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/7/2023 2:35 AM
I'm working on a zine about the Trump indictment. Would anyone be down to review it. Its only like 6 paragraphs
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
I'm working on a zine about the Trump indictment. Would anyone be down to review it. Its only like 6 paragraphs
I’m game
11:41 AM
Also, how would people here feel about an essay advocating for Bill of Rights socialism? As advocated for by cpusa here: https://www.cpusa.org/party_info/socialism-in-the-usa/
Socialism is a common-sense path to a fairer, more prosperous and more democratic USA. WE MAKE IT … Right now, 99% of Americans share the work of producing all of the products and services of our economy. We work together in person or online. We work in factories and offices.
Avatar
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 4/7/2023 1:47 PM
Write up an essay on it
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/8/2023 1:30 PM
@OPRacoon
14.06 KB
1:32 PM
I think what this is missing is something to hook the reader, to make them want to read it.
Avatar
"You WON'T BELIEVE what AIF is up to! Mind blowing!" "Top 15 SHOCKING facts about AIF that you won't believe!"
šŸ˜„ 3
1:47 PM
/S
Avatar
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 4/10/2023 2:11 PM
TOP 5 TIPS TO KICK A NAZI’S ASS!
Avatar
Unu51, Syndicalizer of Anarchy 4/10/2023 2:16 PM
TOP 5 GUNS FOR FASH HUNTING!
Avatar
Has anyone here ever done professional journalism work? Its a field I want to go into so if anyone has please dm because I’m looking for some advice (edited)
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/15/2023 3:07 PM
This is the second draft of the zine i'm working on
14.29 KB
3:12 PM
^ It got the template from the Trenton library, but looking at their other zines I think mine isn't very good: https://www.trentonlib.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/4Hedgepeth-WilliamsOnlinePDF.pdf
Avatar
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 4/15/2023 8:32 PM
I’m still working on my Rome Article
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 4/15/2023 9:27 PM
Would anyone be able to represent the zine at tomorrows general meeting? Date: Sunday 4/16 When: 9 AM PST/12 PM EST (noon) Where: Meeting Room voice chat channel Topics: mutual aid (I got a list of people who seem to have connections, and we can probably put together a network), marketing, networking (National Lawyers Guild?)
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
Would anyone be able to represent the zine at tomorrows general meeting? Date: Sunday 4/16 When: 9 AM PST/12 PM EST (noon) Where: Meeting Room voice chat channel Topics: mutual aid (I got a list of people who seem to have connections, and we can probably put together a network), marketing, networking (National Lawyers Guild?)
I’m planning on attending it, but there are probably other people who could represent the zine better (edited)
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet 5/19/2023 10:33 AM
Hey, so I didn't know where else to put this, but I had a project I wanted to work on and was wondering if anyone would be willing to help me out with the writing. Maybe we could publish it in the zine if y'all want, though it'd be a lot for a single zine issue.
10:34 AM
The project is basically a collection of essays that together constitute a political program for libertarian progressives in the US. I call it the New Americana Program (it's a working title).
10:34 AM
Here's an outline of what I'd like to cover in it:
10:34 AM
I Bibles, Bullets, and Biofuels: American Folk Religion A Well-Regulated Militia Grounded Ecology II The Free Economy: Remutualization Against Monopoly American Made and Built to Last The DIY Ethic Supply Chain Circularity Revive the Commons Labor, Land, and Liberty III The American Idea: Making a Lifelong Learner The Outlaw's History of the United States Trades, Grades, and Renegades The Sudbury Model Libraries as Community Centers IV New American Renaissance: American Literary Tradition Behind & Beyond Hollywood The Devil at the Crossroads Paintings, Pictures, and Pixel Pioneers V Land of the Free, Home of the Brave: The American Frontier, Decolonized The American Bill of Rights, Aggrandized The American Government, Democratized The American Civil Structure, Decentralized The American Armed Forces, Deprivatized The American Infrastructure, Modernized The American People, Demarginalized The American Worker, Unionized The American Health, Revitalized
Avatar
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet
I Bibles, Bullets, and Biofuels: American Folk Religion A Well-Regulated Militia Grounded Ecology II The Free Economy: Remutualization Against Monopoly American Made and Built to Last The DIY Ethic Supply Chain Circularity Revive the Commons Labor, Land, and Liberty III The American Idea: Making a Lifelong Learner The Outlaw's History of the United States Trades, Grades, and Renegades The Sudbury Model Libraries as Community Centers IV New American Renaissance: American Literary Tradition Behind & Beyond Hollywood The Devil at the Crossroads Paintings, Pictures, and Pixel Pioneers V Land of the Free, Home of the Brave: The American Frontier, Decolonized The American Bill of Rights, Aggrandized The American Government, Democratized The American Civil Structure, Decentralized The American Armed Forces, Deprivatized The American Infrastructure, Modernized The American People, Demarginalized The American Worker, Unionized The American Health, Revitalized
joe hill’s revenge 5/19/2023 1:59 PM
I think we can work on that
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID] 5/19/2023 2:12 PM
Maybe the zine and podcast could work together?
Avatar
Avatar
floppunism [BOI, ID]
Maybe the zine and podcast could work together?
joe hill’s revenge 5/19/2023 3:49 PM
yes, we should have a full multimedia offensive!
Avatar
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet
I Bibles, Bullets, and Biofuels: American Folk Religion A Well-Regulated Militia Grounded Ecology II The Free Economy: Remutualization Against Monopoly American Made and Built to Last The DIY Ethic Supply Chain Circularity Revive the Commons Labor, Land, and Liberty III The American Idea: Making a Lifelong Learner The Outlaw's History of the United States Trades, Grades, and Renegades The Sudbury Model Libraries as Community Centers IV New American Renaissance: American Literary Tradition Behind & Beyond Hollywood The Devil at the Crossroads Paintings, Pictures, and Pixel Pioneers V Land of the Free, Home of the Brave: The American Frontier, Decolonized The American Bill of Rights, Aggrandized The American Government, Democratized The American Civil Structure, Decentralized The American Armed Forces, Deprivatized The American Infrastructure, Modernized The American People, Demarginalized The American Worker, Unionized The American Health, Revitalized
joe hill’s revenge 5/19/2023 3:54 PM
This reads like it would need to be a whole issue of a regular magazine or published in shorter installments
3:54 PM
it covers a lot of topics
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet 5/19/2023 5:18 PM
Yeah, I figured it would be a lot for a single zine release.
5:21 PM
Should we use Etherpad or what?
Avatar
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet
Should we use Etherpad or what?
Skullmaggot 5/20/2023 7:57 PM
You could also collaborate with CryptPad, which is e2e encrypted.
Avatar
Avatar
Skullmaggot
You could also collaborate with CryptPad, which is e2e encrypted.
DevilTheAutopoet 6/6/2023 12:52 PM
I've set up a Cryptpad doc. Just fleshing a few things out before I open it up. Thanks for letting me know about CryptPad.
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
Avatar
DevilTheAutopoet
I've set up a Cryptpad doc. Just fleshing a few things out before I open it up. Thanks for letting me know about CryptPad.
Skullmaggot 6/7/2023 3:57 AM
You're welcome.
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 7/8/2023 12:20 PM
The Republican Primary Campaign is Going to be a Hard and Bloody Fight that will Expose Faultline's on the Right
12:20 PM
@OPRacoon
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge 7/8/2023 4:40 PM
@NGNMGoon @Eazy8 Antifa Viking
Avatar
Avatar
joe hill’s revenge
@NGNMGoon @Eazy8 Antifa Viking
Eazy8 Antifa Viking 7/8/2023 5:56 PM
Work
šŸ‘ 1
Avatar
Awesome, sorry I’ve been busy been doing a lot of local work lately but the article is great
Avatar
Avatar
OPRacoon
Awesome, sorry I’ve been busy been doing a lot of local work lately but the article is great
joe hill’s revenge 7/10/2023 2:21 AM
Could you please share it with your local comrades?
Avatar
Avatar
OPRacoon
Awesome, sorry I’ve been busy been doing a lot of local work lately but the article is great
joe hill’s revenge 7/10/2023 2:21 AM
And subscribe for more
Avatar
absolutely
Exported 337 message(s)
Timezone: UTC-5